The Jury Room

by **tucco** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 9:30 am

Can't wait to get to the store!

Don't know which ones I'll buy first...

Anybody else excited for this? If so, what will YOU buy first?

I'll probably go with Abbey Road and Past Masters (now all in one package, 1 and 2) to start out with.

http://www.dvdspot.com/member=PaulKile · by **Paul Kile** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 11:06 am

I reserved a complete stereo set of discs at Barnes and Noble yesterday - will go pick them up after work, armed with my Member discount card and a 15% off coupon from the Internet.

I know the true Beatle enthusiasts will turn up their nose at the stereo versions (at least up until the later albums), but for me the "cool" thing was stereo back in 1965, and I always tried to find the stereo albums.

Interesting thing, my wife (who is an ardent Susie Orman devotee and questions EVERY purchase I make) made no negative comments when I reserved our set.

by **Stubblecat** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 11:33 am

I know I will eventually get them, but I've bought and re-bought the Beatles' catalogue so many times that I'm just not able to go out and do it again immediately.

I ditched the horrible 'official' discs a long time ago in favour of my bootlegged Dr. Ebbett mono & stereo versions. As well as the Canadian, U.S. and German mixes.

What really gets my goat is that they really should have just made one big-ass box set with both the mono and stereo versions on one disc. After all, every album with a mono mix is short enough to accomodate both versions on one CD with the exception of The White Album.

But I quibble, I suppose. The simple fact that right this very second there are potentially millions of people buying their first Beatles' CD makes me happy.

by **Dunnyman** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 12:14 pm

On a tight budget, but Rubber Soul and Revolver are sounding soooooo good.

by **Stubblecat** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 2:13 pm

If your budget only allows two Beatles' discs, it might as well be those two.

by **Dunnyman** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 2:35 pm

Stubblecat wrote:If your budget only allows two Beatles' discs, it might as well be those two.

Don't know what they're going for elsewhere, but I snagged these at Target for 11.98 each, plus a five dollar gift card with the purchase of any two CD's. So just under ten bucks each after taxes? Pretty good deal.

by **Stubblecat** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 3:41 pm

Up here in the frozen North they're at an average of $12.99 each for the singles, and $22.99 for the two doubles.

Still though: That's pretty dear for a guy with a thousand-dollar-a-month child support habit.

by **tucco** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 4:22 am

Stubblecat wrote:Up here in the frozen North they're at an average of $12.99 each for the singles, and $22.99 for the two doubles.

Still though: That's pretty dear for a guy with a thousand-dollar-a-month child support habit.

Grab your favorite then! They sound so incredible! The opening tom fills on Something off of Abbey Road sound so vastly improved and resonant I started the song over eight times just to marvel at the sound......you are THERE in the recording booth with them....

by **Dan Mancini** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 5:57 am

Dunnyman wrote:On a tight budget, but Rubber Soul and Revolver are sounding soooooo good.

I think I'm gonna take the Target deal on Rubber Soul and The White Album...and maybe Abbey Road...and maybe...uh oh.

http://www.dvdspot.com/member=PaulKile · by **Paul Kile** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 6:02 am

I had a similar experience to tucco last night. So far I have only listened to two discs, Please Please Me and Rubber Soul. The biggest improvements I noticed are the spatial imaging of the instruments and the clarity of the voices, when compared to my older Rubber Soul CD. The stereo mix has been improved and no longer seems as "contrived" as the older version. The voices come through with more depth and don't sound thin and reedy as before. The sitar on Norwegian Wood is more distinct than before, and Ringo's finger cymbals really pop out of my speakers.

My only minor gripe is the song Please Please Me, which does not show the level of improvement seen in the later songs. I can forgive this, given the age of that song and what they had to work with.

The reviewers are right - the sound quality is pretty darn amazing for 45-year-old material!

by **BenSaylor** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 10:34 am

I traded in a stack of old DVDs/CDs, which cut the stereo box price in half. Haven't listened to everything yet (not in a particular hurry to hear Yellow Submarine), but what I've listened to sounds great for the most part. After going through Sgt. Pepper a few times, I'm now stuck on Please Please Me and With the Beatles. My biggest complaint about the whole thing is that the CDs are in cardboard sleeves. I hate sliding discs out of cardboard packaging; I'm always afraid of damaging them. They admittedly look nicer than plastic cases, but I like being able to pop a disc (be it CD or DVD) out clean.

by **tucco** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 11:14 am

BenSaylor wrote:I traded in a stack of old DVDs/CDs, which cut the stereo box price in half. Haven't listened to everything yet (not in a particular hurry to hear Yellow Submarine), but what I've listened to sounds great for the most part. After going through Sgt. Pepper a few times, I'm now stuck on Please Please Me and With the Beatles. My biggest complaint about the whole thing is that the CDs are in cardboard sleeves. I hate sliding discs out of cardboard packaging; I'm always afraid of damaging them. They admittedly look nicer than plastic cases, but I like being able to pop a disc (be it CD or DVD) out clean.

I agree, I'm afraid of scratches....and a few of my friends said the same thing....I'll keep the disk itself in a jewel case.

by **erich** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 12:49 pm

I'm still kicking myself for waiting too long to order Rubber Soul, Revolver, and Hard Day's Night the other week when Amazon had them for $9.99. By the next day they were back up to $12.99. I've been keeping an eye on prices over there, though, and ordered Past Masters today, which they currently have for $12.99 (just shy of half the retail price). Free shipping being what it is, I probably won't get it for a while, but that's okay. I'll tide myself over with Beatles: Rock Band until then.

by **calvert87** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 1:36 pm

I got the stereo box yesterday (Mono Box coming later this month). All I can say is they did a truly amazing job on this. I started with the first disc of the White Album and, as someone who has only had the '87 discs,truly felt like I was hearing it for the first time. I immediately brought them home and ripped them in Apple lossless to put on my iPod and have been playing them over and over like I did when I first got into the Beatles when I was in school. As angry as I was (and am) about the price gouging, I will have no regrets shelling out the serious cash that it required to get the best versions of this music that is available commercially at this time.

Edit: My only complaint is that my Sgt. Pepper didn't have the booklet (but I ended up with two copies of A Hard Day's Night, go figure).

by **tucco** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 3:09 pm

Newbury Comics has the single disks for $11.88 and the two double disks for 17.99.

Damn good deal, doesn't
get much better than that!

by **Stubblecat** » Sun Sep 13, 2009 5:00 am

I got a chance to enjoy Revolver yesterday. I've been listening to the Dr. Ebbett needledrops for years now, so I can't even remember how bad the original 1987 discs sounded. I recall them being tinny.

What struck me was the new immediacy of the songs. The strings on 'Elenor Rigby' carry a real bottom-end weight to them now. On 'Here, There And Everywhere' the drums sound like you're sitting next to Ringo's kit. The piano on 'Good Day Sunshine' has a next spring in its step, and so on and so forth.

I still stand by my previous quibble (and one new one): First of all, the mono and stereo mixes would easily fit on one disc each. It's a little bit gougey to make the original mono mixes available only as an overpriced box set, while charging full price for the stereo CDs, some of which only run about 30 minutes.

I understand maintaining the integrity of the original albums, but the Past Masters set is unecessary. It would have been far more relavatory to include the non-album singles and b-sides at the end of each disc, giving some perspective to the musical growth that was occuring between full albums. And at the same time giving a little more value for your dollar.

by **Steve T Power** » Sun Sep 13, 2009 9:30 pm

I snagged a copy of the Stereo set, not even being much of a Beatles fan to begin with, and i must say, wow! That sound quality is redonkulously good. It's like hearing the band for the first time, and outside of a few tunes here and there, the whole thing sounds like it was recorded yesterday.

by **HGervais** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 11:35 am

Picked up "Abbey Road", "Rubber Soul", "Sgt. Pepper" and "The Beatles".....I really should have held out and gotten the box set. Comparing these discs to my old CDs there is no comparison. So was "Abbey Road" the only Beatles album actually mixed for stereo?

by **erich** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 12:11 pm

HGervais wrote:Picked up "Abbey Road", "Rubber Soul", "Sgt. Pepper" and "The Beatles".....I really should have held out and gotten the box set. Comparing these discs to my old CDs there is no comparison.

I'm with you. After picking up Rubber Soul, Revolver, and Sgt. Pepper, I wish I'd just ponied up the $180 and gotten the full set off Amazon. It's all I can do to keep myself from going out and spending the $14 per disc Walmart (my lone local Beatles resource) is charging. At least I can justify buying the collection piecemeal by telling myself I don't really need Let It Be or Yellow Submarine.

Favorite moments anyone? For some reason I'm stuck on the backing harmony at the very end of "Here, There and Everywhere."

by **Steve T Power** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 12:18 pm

Favorite moment thus far for me:

Past Masters: Disc 2 - We Can work it out.

Probably my favorite Beatles tune anyway. The remaster just sounds so damn warm and enticing.

by **Dunnyman** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 12:30 pm

Favorite moment so far: "In My Life", which has always been a favorite, and now it sounds like I'm Room 2 at Abbey Road with the lads. Sends chills up and down my spine...I'm soooo glad Sir George Martin took this project on, because frankly, I don't think anyone else could have done it justice.

by **HGervais** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 12:47 pm

Dunnyman wrote:Favorite moment so far: "In My Life", which has always been a favorite, and now it sounds like I'm Room 2 at Abbey Road with the lads. Sends chills up and down my spine...I'm soooo glad Sir George Martin took this project on, because frankly, I don't think anyone else could have done it justice.

Ditto. "In My Life" is my favorite Beatles song although "Happiness Is A Warm Gun" is another favorite. I will say in many cases thus far it is like listening to the albums for the first time.

by **erich** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 1:10 pm

It's amazing how the clarity and increased detail keeps me from skipping past songs I've never been that crazy about ("When I'm Sixty-Four," for example). I don't think I've ever enjoyed "Got To Get You Into My Life" the way I do now.

Another favorite moment: the final chord of "A Day In The Life." Cliched, perhaps, but man it goes on forever. Not sure I'd never heard that chair squeak at the end before.

by **Stubblecat** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 2:11 pm

HGervais wrote: So was "Abbey Road" the only Beatles album actually mixed for stereo?

As a proper album, it was the only one that the Beatles sat down and mixed in stereo. Various cuts before that record had the Beatle's touch on the stereo mixes, but for about 98% of everything they would obsess over the mono mix (because most young music fans didn't have stereo playback), and then leave the stereo mixes to George Martin and the studio engineers.

Let It Be doesn't count, as it was just cobbled together by Phil Spector.

by **tucco** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 10:48 pm

Every store I've been in that has the Remasters were all sold out of Revolver........but had every other title.
It fits in with the current trend of claiming Revolver is their best album....which has been the list trend for a few years now in magazines, etc.
It goes in cycles, the "lists" sometimes universally select St.Pepper as number one, especially in the eighties, then it switches to The Beatles... And sometimes Abbey Road.

It seems those are the only four that ever claim the number one spot.

In my mind there is a case for A Hard Days Night or Help! for pure excellence and growth during that under-heralded period between With The Beatles and Rubber Soul. Not quite "She Loves You", but not quite "In My Life" either....But the first major move forward and not enough credit for these two albums.

by **HGervais** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 12:26 am

I keep coming back to "Rubber Soul" as my favorite. "The Beatles" comes close and I do love "Abbey Road." I basically went for my favorite 4 albums but now hearing how good these discs sound, all of a sudden I want the rest of them.

by **tucco** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 1:56 am

HGervais wrote:I basically went for my favorite 4 albums but now hearing how good these discs sound, all of a sudden I want the rest of them.

I know what you mean.....I want them all too. There just too damn great sounding, and I really expected them to be way more expensive then they are. $11.98 on sale ($17.98 for double disks) is just awesome.

by **tucco** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 2:50 am

I just wish the damn mono versions were available as single disks intstead of just a box set....

by **erich** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 6:54 am

tucco wrote:In my mind there is a case for A Hard Days Night or Help! for pure excellence and growth during that under-heralded period between With The Beatles and Rubber Soul.

Agreed. I want those albums next, even before the White Album or Abbey Road. I played the heck out of both when I was younger, and can't wait to hear the new stereo mix on A Hard Day's Night. While it's not top of my list, I've also got a soft spot for Beatles For Sale.

by **Stubblecat** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 7:28 am

tucco wrote:I just wish the damn mono versions were available as single disks intstead of just a box set....

Or at least they could have put both versions on one disc. The only way a regular listener can truly appreciate the mono mixes is to compare them immediately to the stereo versions.

To just listen to the mono box would be sort of pointless for most people, and this is coming from a hardcore Beatles fan who has owned all the U.K. mono editions for years. The new stereo mixes are simply brilliant. The mono mixes, while amazing, are now a bit more of a curiosity. Most of the differences are subtle. It isn't *really* until Revolver through The Beatles where you can notice really obvious differences. Sgt. Pepper has some big changes, and the mono mix of The Beatles is like a whole different album at times.

But again: They could have easily put both versions of every mono album on one disc apiece, with The Beatles and Masters being the exceptions. That way, you could listen to 'Sgt. Pepper Reprise' and then check out the mono mix with an extra drum pattern, or the hear the freaky laughter on 'Within You Without You' after hearing the stereo cut.

by **tucco** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 11:07 am

Stubblecat wrote:
tucco wrote:I just wish the damn mono versions were available as single disks intstead of just a box set....

Or at least they could have put both versions on one disc. The only way a regular listener can truly appreciate the mono mixes is to compare them immediately to the stereo versions.

To just listen to the mono box would be sort of pointless for most people, and this is coming from a hardcore Beatles fan who has owned all the U.K. mono editions for years. The new stereo mixes are simply brilliant. The mono mixes, while amazing, are now a bit more of a curiosity. Most of the differences are subtle. It isn't *really* until Revolver through The Beatles where you can notice really obvious differences. Sgt. Pepper has some big changes, and the mono mix of The Beatles is like a whole different album at times.

But again: They could have easily put both versions of every mono album on one disc apiece, with The Beatles and Masters being the exceptions. That way, you could listen to 'Sgt. Pepper Reprise' and then check out the mono mix with an extra drum pattern, or the hear the freaky laughter on 'Within You Without You' after hearing the stereo cut.

Right on, and I agree with your idea on another post to put the singles on the disks as bonus tracks to show growth between albums. Excellent idea....For example, tack "I Want To Hold Your Hand" onto With The Beatles; "Paperback Writer/Rain" onto Rubber Soul, etc.

by **Dunnyman** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 12:33 pm

Stubblecat wrote:Let It Be doesn't count, as it was just cobbled together by Phil Spector.

Speaking of which, is it the polished Let It Be or the "naked" version on these remasters? If it's the naked, no rush to buy that album, if it's the polished, can't wait to hear what George Martin did to it!
Broke down last night and snagged Sgt. Pepper's, HELP! and Abbey Road, and as it's been said, it's like a whole new album to listen to. You can hear so much more than ever before....

by **erich** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 1:58 pm

Dunnyman wrote:Broke down last night and snagged Sgt. Pepper's, HELP! and Abbey Road, and as it's been said, it's like a whole new album to listen to. You can hear so much more than ever before....

How much improved is Abbey Road? From some of the reviews, it sounded like it was the least improved of the albums since it was so good to start with. How's Help!, by the way? Love that album.

by **Steve T Power** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 3:31 pm

Dunnyman wrote:
Stubblecat wrote:Let It Be doesn't count, as it was just cobbled together by Phil Spector.

Speaking of which, is it the polished Let It Be or the "naked" version on these remasters? If it's the naked, no rush to buy that album, if it's the polished, can't wait to hear what George Martin did to it!
Broke down last night and snagged Sgt. Pepper's, HELP! and Abbey Road, and as it's been said, it's like a whole new album to listen to. You can hear so much more than ever before....

It's the original, which i vastly prefer. Spectorized or not. It has a stronger presence all around. I don't give a shit what the hardcore Beatles fans say about the band's (or more likely McCartney's) intentions of going back to the stripped down style of their early work. The damn album sat unfinished and abandoned for over a year before Spector made something out of it (with Lennon's blessings).

by **Stubblecat** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 7:35 pm

I agree with Steve. I've known the Phil Spector versions my entire life, so to me the original tapes are always going to be nothing but bootlegs.

People can crap on Phil Spector's mix and additions all they want, but he salvaged some brilliance and did make some real improvements.

I have copies of the two original versions of Let It Be, which were originally called Get Back, and while pretty darned good, just didn't have the studio focus of Spector's version. They felt much more like scrappy live albums.

by **tucco** » Wed Sep 16, 2009 9:42 pm

Let It Be will always be the original release.
Like mentioned above, it's all most of us have ever known, therefore it is THE version.
Naked is just a curiosity.

by **Stubblecat** » Thu Sep 17, 2009 5:59 am

Okay, love me or hate me, but here's what I did:

I'm lucky enough that I have a good friend who's both an audiophile and someone who trusts me with his stuff.

I borrowed both of his Beatles' sets and made my own master set. Before everyone starts yelling at me about copyright, let me remind you that in Canada it's still technically legal to copy music AND I've bought these damned things on vinyl, cassette and CD over the years. Shelling out $500 for two more box sets just isn't in the cards right now. Sorry.

So I ripped everything lossless and put both the mono versions and stereo versions on one disc each (where possible). I ended up with a 22-disc set. Every album with both a stereo and mono mix is just one disc, Help! and Rubber Soul are two discs each (because of the extra stereo mixes that come with the mono set) and The Beatles and the Past Masters are 4-discs each. And the mini documentaries is on one DVD. 22 discs, all told.

Nice and tidy. Sure, I don't have the beautiful artwork, but I do plan on eventually buying the stereo discs one by one over time. But the way I did it certainly makes much more sense than the separate box sets.

by **Dunnyman** » Thu Sep 17, 2009 1:16 pm

erich wrote:
Dunnyman wrote:Broke down last night and snagged Sgt. Pepper's, HELP! and Abbey Road, and as it's been said, it's like a whole new album to listen to. You can hear so much more than ever before....

How much improved is Abbey Road? From some of the reviews, it sounded like it was the least improved of the albums since it was so good to start with. How's Help!, by the way? Love that album.

Abbey Road doesn't show as much improvement as the others because that was their high point with George at the helm, damn near perfectly mixed and recorded, one can only dream about what the next album would have been like had there been one. It mainly shows improved clarity in tones, MacCartney's bass always sounded a tad muted to me before, now it's really clear, and The End's solos come through in more detail (just in case anyone forgot, George leads off, Paul's up second with John coming in last, repeat as needed.) and damn anyone who disses the Beatles as guitarists, the thing freaking rocks.
HELP! is proving to be a lovely surprise as I'm hearing all kinds of stuff I missed before. The title track, Yesterday, Ticket To Ride all shine through perfectly, with the harmonies on the title track sounding as if they were singing them in my living room, just for me. The biggest thrill for me on it, is Dizzy Miss Lizzy, which always sounded a bit watered down, especially when they knocked it out so quickly (2-3 takes) and went with it as is with little or no overdubs. Now? I have a much better idea what they sounded like live. Four guys, two guitars, bass and a basic drum kit, absolutely kicking ass and showing off just why they WERE the biggest and baddest of them all. Sure, strings, extra percussion, keyboards etc, were all well and good, but these guys still knew how to rock. George's I Need You also comes through with some extra clarity and his 12 string sounds sooooo good.
Sgt. Pepper has never been my favorite disc, but this version may change that. Once again, it sounds like I'm there as they recorded much of it, and the reprise literally thunders out of the speakers and once again shows you that these guys knew how to rock the house.
3 superb discs, and Target STILL has the sale going on, 11.98 each and a five dollar gift card if you buy two.

by **Dan Mancini** » Thu Sep 17, 2009 3:57 pm

Dunnyman wrote:Abbey Road doesn't show as much improvement as the others because that was their high point with George at the helm, damn near perfectly mixed and recorded, one can only dream about what the next album would have been like had there been one. It mainly shows improved clarity in tones, MacCartney's bass always sounded a tad muted to me before, now it's really clear, and The End's solos come through in more detail (just in case anyone forgot, George leads off, Paul's up second with John coming in last, repeat as needed.) and damn anyone who disses the Beatles as guitarists, the thing freaking rocks.

"Because" is the most radically different tune on the record to my ears. There's all sorts of layered keyboard stuff going on that was muted and relegated to the background of the original mix. Abbey Road is a fine piece of work from top to bottom. And The White Album is two discs of frickin' pure magnificence. Since the Target sale is still on, I think my next grabs will be Rubber Soul and A Hard Day's Night.

Listening to the Beatles a lot again for the first time in a long while has brought to mind what really made them great: There's never a sense in any of their music that they were looking for some repeatable formula for pop music success. They never said, "Okay, 'Help' was a big hit. Let's try doing more stuff like that." They just went where inspiration led them -- and, I gotta say, the number and quality of songs they cranked out between 1962 and 1969 is un-fargin-believable.

by **Dunnyman** » Thu Sep 17, 2009 4:27 pm

Dan Mancini wrote:Listening to the Beatles a lot again for the first time in a long while has brought to mind what really made them great: There's never a sense in any of their music that they were looking for some repeatable formula for pop music success. They never said, "Okay, 'Help' was a big hit. Let's try doing more stuff like that." They just went where inspiration led them -- and, I gotta say, the number and quality of songs they cranked out between 1962 and 1969 is un-fargin-believable.

Exactly. Help!, Yesterday, Nowhere Man, Rain, Love You To, Got To Get You Into My Life, Tomorrow Never Knows, For No One, Lucy In The Sky, Strawberry Fields Forever, A Day in The Life and Within You Without You and She's Leaving Home are all incredibly different styles of songs, but they all work, and that was just from 65 to late 66!

by **tucco** » Thu Sep 17, 2009 7:16 pm

That reminds me of the good ole days when bands' work rate, song/album output was in high gear.
Aerosmith, Led Zeppelin, the Stones and all the big groups put out albums (practically) each and every year.
All classic too, not crap. Hell, Kiss put out a record every six months.
It was just standard operating procedure. The bands today on the whole can't even start to compete.
What newer bands have a 5 to 6 year output that compares with Aerosmith's first five albums' quality, let alone the Beatles?

by **Dunnyman** » Fri Sep 18, 2009 8:03 am

tucco wrote:That reminds me of the good ole days when bands' work rate, song/album output was in high gear.
Aerosmith, Led Zeppelin, the Stones and all the big groups put out albums (practically) each and every year.
All classic too, not crap. Hell, Kiss put out a record every six months.
It was just standard operating procedure. The bands today on the whole can't even start to compete.
What newer bands have a 5 to 6 year output that compares with Aerosmith's first five albums' quality, let alone the Beatles?

I think the only current working band that can even come close would be U2, it seems they're about one album every other year or so, and they do tour a fair bit, but yeah, I remember when some bands could put out a record a year or even better, like Cheap trick hitting us with Heaven Tonight, At Budokan and Dream Police all within a 13 month window. I just wish some of my favorite newer bands could come close to it. I think Fountains of Wayne is great, but four albums and a outtakes package over 15 years? Wimps.

by **erich** » Fri Sep 18, 2009 12:24 pm

Thanks to Dunnyman for the heads up on Target's ongoing sale. I thought maybe they were just extending it another week, but I called the local store and they said it lasts until 10/10. I'll definitely head over there this weekend to spend more money I don't have.

The days of rapid album releases do seem to be over, though the instant gratification of the internet may bring some of that back. Look at what Jonathan Coulton did with his Thing a Week project—one new song a week for a full year. Impressive! They Might Be Giants are no slouches, either, when it comes to putting out new material even if it's more in podcast and EP form than proper album releases.

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